TIFFIN Complaints

DEF head failure at 7,000 miles. Engine derated on highway, went into limp mode.

WE ARE HAVING A PROBLEM WITH THE SIDING CRACKING ON OUR TIFFIN ALLEGRO OPEN ROAD 36. AFTER RETURNING FROM A PERIODIC MAINTENANCE SESSION AT LAZYDAYS RV DEALERSHIP (SEFFNER, FL) AND SETTLING IN AT OUR CAMPGROUND IN LAKELAND FL, WE NOTICED ON JANUARY 17, 2021 THAT OUR CAMPER DISPLAYED AN APPROXIMATELY TEN-INCH-LONG CRACK IN THE SIDING ON THE PASSENGER SIDE, JUST TO THE LOWER RIGHT CORNER OF THE SLIDE OUT ON THAT SIDE (SEE PICTURE). WE EMAILED TIFFIN'S SERVICE DEPARTMENT, WHICH RESPONDED BY SAYING THAT THEY WERE AWARE OF SIMILAR ISSUES AND OFFERED TO PAY FOR ITS REPAIR. WE MADE AN APPOINTMENT TO HAVE LAZYDAYS EFFECT THAT REMEDY. SCHEDULING CONCERNS DICTATED THAT THE APPOINTMENT WAS NOT UNTIL MAY 3, 2021. IN THE MEANTIME, WE REMAINED IN PLACE AT OUR LAKELAND CAMPGROUND. UPON OUR RETURN TO LAZYDAYS, THE SERVICE REPRESENTATIVE POINTED OUT THAT A SECOND NEW CRACK HAD DEVELOPED ON THE PASSENGER SIDE, TRAILING FROM BELOW THE PASSENGER WINDOW HEADING TOWARDS THE DOOR FRAME (SEE PICTURE). THE SERVICE REPRESENTATIVE SAID HE HAD WORKED A SIMILAR ISSUE RECENTLY ON ANOTHER TIFFIN OPEN ROAD IN WHICH TIFFIN PAID FOR THE REPAIR. WE ALSO NOTED THAT THE FIRST CRACK WE IDENTIFIED HAD SEPARATED FURTHER. AT THIS TIME, WE BECAME CONCERNED ABOUT THE OUTER BODY DELAMINATING WHILE DRIVING. TIFFIN HAS YET TO PROVIDE AN EXPLANATION CONCERNING THIS. IN ADDITION, TIFFIN'S LOCAL REPRESENTATIVE AT LAZYDAYS REFUSED TO OFFER SUFFICIENT WARRANTY ASSISTANCE TO PAY FOR BOTH CRACKS. HE ALSO SAID, WITHOUT HAVING LOOKED AT OUR RV, THAT IT WAS SAFE TO DRIVE FROM TAMPA UP TO ITS FACILITIES IN RED BAY, AL. WE EXPRESSED OUR CONCERN ABOUT THE SAFETY OF DRIVING THAT FAR, GIVEN THAT THESE TWO APPARENTLY STRUCTURAL CRACKS DEVELOPED AFTER THE TWO SHORT 25 MILE DRIVES BETWEEN OUR LAKELAND CAMPGROUND AND LAZYDAYS. WE CANNOT IMAGINE WHAT WOULD HAPPEN DURING A SEVERAL HUNDRED-MILE JOURNEY.

THE EPA CAME OUT WITH REQUIREMENTS IN 2013 THAT ALL DIESEL ENGINES HAVE A POLLUTION MITIGATING DEF (DIESEL EXHAUST FLUID) SYSTEM. APPARENTLY, THE EPA REQUIRED THE INDUSTRY TO MEASURE THE FOLLOWING THREE ITEMS WITH RESPECT TO BLUE DEF. - LEVEL OF DEF - TEMPERATURE OF DEF - QUALITY OF DEF I HAVE BEEN TOLD THAT THE EPA GRANTED AN EXTENSION OF THE THIRD REQUIREMENT, QUALITY OF DEF, SINCE NO ONE COULD MANUFACTURE THE EQUIPMENT NECESSARY TO DO SO. THIS EXTENSION APPARENTLY LASTED UNTIL 2017. THESE DEF SENSORS BEING INSTALLED ARE FAILING AT AN ALARMING RATE, MANY WITHIN ONLY A FEW MILES. WHEN DEF SENSORS FAIL THE ENGINE CAN GO INTO DERATE MODE WHICH IS 5 MPH. THIS PROBLEM IS LEAVING MANY LARGE DIESEL ENGINE OWNED VEHICLES STRANDED, FROM MOTORHOMES TO LARGE OVER THE ROAD TRUCKS. CURRENTLY, THE ONLY COMPANY THAT MAKES THE DEF SENSORS IS SHAW DEVELOPMENT. SHAW DEVELOPMENT WILL NOT TAKE CALLS OR EMAILS REQUESTING INFORMATION REGARDING THIS PROBLEM. AGAIN, THE DEF SENSOR REQUIREMENT WAS A REGULATION PASSED BY EPA IN 2013, STATING THE DEF CONCENTRATION (QUALITY) BE MEASURED IN THE DEF TANKS OF VEHICLES. HOWEVER, THE DEF SENSOR MANUFACTURERS CANNOT SEEM TO MANUFACTURE A PART THAT IS RELIABLE AND NOT PUT ENGINE INTO A POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS DERATE MODE. SHAW DEVELOPMENT IS CURRENTLY ON THE SIXTH GENERATION OF THE DEF SENSOR WHICH ARE STILL FAILING ON BRAND NEW 2021 VEHICLES. THAT IS SIX ATTEMPTS TO MAKE A PART THAT CONTINUES TO LEAVE PEOPLE STRANDED. I HAVE NO ARGUMENT WITH THE NEED FOR THIS SMOG REDUCING MITIGATION EQUIPMENT. WHAT I DO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH, IS THE EPA REQUIREMENT TO MEASURE THE QUALITY OF DEF WHEN NO ONE CAN PRODUCE A RELIABLE PRODUCT TO DO SO, AND THE EFFECT THAT IT IS HAVING ON THE TRANSPORTATION INDUSTRY. I WOULD LIKE TO ASK THAT YOU REQUEST THE EPA TO SUSPEND THIS REQUIREMENT UNTIL SOMEONE CAN PRODUCE A RELIABLE PRODUCT TO MEASURE THE QUALITY OF DEF.

IN JULY OF 2020 THE LEFT FRONT WHEEL SENSOR FAILED CAUSING ABS/CRUISE CONTROL AND RSC TO FAIL. ON JANUARY 18TH, 2021 THE LEFT REAR WHEEL SPEED SENSOR FIALED PROVIDING FAULT CODE C0037. THE ABS/CRUISE CONTROL AND RSC FAILED. SYMPTOMS INCLUDE TRANSMISSION SHIFT ISSUES AND SPEED ISSUES. NORMAL DRIVING CONDITIONS AND IT WAS NOTSET OF BY HIGH WINDS AS REPORTED BY OTHER OWNERS. THIS FAILURE IS CAUSING AN UNSAFE DRIVING CONDITION. I WAS DRIVING AT 60 MPH ON THE HIGHWAY NORMAL WEATHER NO RAIN OR WINDS.

WHEEL SPEED SENSORS WENT OUT,AND WENT INTO LIMP MOOD,TRANSMISSION WOULD NOT, SHIFT,LIGHTS CAME ON DASH,ABS,CHECK ENGINE LIGHT,AND MOORE. THIS WAS ON A INTERSTATE,GOOD WAY TO GET RUN OVER. WE ARE IN A REV CLUB THERE IS A LOT OF THIS GOING ON.

UPON PURCHASING THIS 2021 TIFFIN PHAETON RV, I REALIZED THE "A PILLARS" CAUSED MIRROR AND VISUAL OBSTRUCTION. INITIALLY BELIEVING IT WAS A MIRROR ADJUSTMENT, I LEARNED THAT THE DRIVER SEAT WAS NOT CENTERED ON THE STEERING WHEEL / DASHBOARD AND IT WAS POSITIONED TO THE LEFT APPROX. 2"-3". NOT ONLY DOES THIS PREVENT A CLEAR VIEW TO THE MIRRORS, BUT IT CAUSES "PEDAL CONFUSION" AND COULD RESULT IN A CATASTROPHIC COLLISION RESULTING IN A FATAL(S) THE DISTANCE BETWEEN THE GAS AND BRAKE PEDALS ARE APPROX. 3". HAVING THE DRIVER NOT CENTERED ON THE STEERING WHEEL AND STEERING COLUMN CREATES SEVERAL SAFETY ISSUES. WHEN SPEAKING WITH TIFFIN REPRESENTATIVE (JEREMY NEWELL), HE STATED THE DRIVER SEAT POSITION WAS AN ISSUE IN 2020 AND THEY MANUFACTURED A BASE PLATE TO SHIFT THE SEAT OVER TO CENTER IT ON THE STEERING WHEEL AND DASHBOARD. THIS ALSO POSITIONED THE DRIVER SEAT CORRECTLY OVER THE GAS AND BRAKE PEDALS THUS PREVENTING "PEDAL CONFUSION". GREG DEES (REGIONAL DIRECTOR) AT TIFFIN ADVISED NHTSA HAS APPROVED THIS SEATED POSITION AND THAT THE "LEGAL TEAM" AT TIFFIN ADVISED THEY SHOULD NOT MANUFACTURE A NEW SEAT BASEPLATE TO CORRECT THE ISSUE BECAUSE IT COULD COMPROMISE THE SAFETY OF THE DRIVER. I ADVISED DEES THEY DID THIS FOR 2020 RV'S AND ASKED WHY WOULDN'T THEY CORRECT THE ISSUE IN MANUFACTURING FOR THE 2021 RV'S? DEES ADMITTED THEY HAVE HAD SIMILAR ISSUES, BUT FOR SOME REASON WON'T ADDRESS THE 2021 RV BECAUSE THEY USED A NEW MANUFACTURE FOR THE SEAT POST ("VILLA") INSTEAD OF FREIGHTLINER. I HAVE EXPRESSED MY CONCERNS WITH TIFFIN WITHOUT ANY SATISFACTION AND AM NOW SEEKING THE ASSISTANCE FROM NHTSA AS WELL AS THE FTC. IT DOESN'T SEEM RIGHT THAT THIS ISSUE SHOULD EVEN MAKE IT THROUGH AN INSPECTION UPON COMING OFF THE MANUFACTURE LINE. I AM ALSO CONCERNED FOR EVERY OTHER 2021 TIFFIN OWNER. I HAVE INCLUDED 5 PHOTOS USING A STEEL RULER.

CRUISE CONTROL DISENGAGE WHILE DRIVING, AIR BRAKES GAUGES DROP DEAD AND BRAKE WANING LIGHTS COME. ALSO THE MIL LIGHT COMES ON AND THE MESSAGE CENTER READS 'CHECK ENGINE'. YOU HAVE TO SMACK THE TOP OF THE DASH TO GET IT TO READ NORMAL. THIS HAPPENS WEATHER STANDING STILL OR DRIVING. YOU HAVE TO KEEP LOOKING DOWN AT THE DASH TO SEE WHAT HAPPENING NOW, THIS IS DANGEROUS.

AT 23000 MILES MY RIGHT OUTER DUEL MICHELIN TIRE BLEW WHILE TRAVELING AT 60 MPH ON I77. ENDED UP GETTING OFF HIGHWAY AND INTO A PLAZA WHERE ROAD SERVICE REPLACED THE TIRE.IT HAD A ZIPPER RIP IN THE SIDEWALL TIRES STILL HAVE 9/16" TREAD,WERE LOADED WITH105# AIR PRESSURE ACCORDING TO WEIGHT AND MICHELINS CHARTS.TIRES WERE ALWAYS COVERED WHEN NOT TRAVELING (TO PROTECT FROM UVRAYS,)THEY HAD TIRE MONITOR SYSTEM THAT SHOWED NORMAL PRESSURE AND TEMP.TIRES ARE MICHELIN 275/80R22.5 X LINE ENERGY 16 PLY H RATING WITH DATE CODE OF 3316.MICHELIN REP (ALVIN) TELLS ME THEY HAVE HAD SEVERAL THAT HAVE HAD BLOWOUTS.RODA SERVICE HAD TO PUT ON A COOPER 295/75R22.5 TIRE AS NO MICHELINS WERE AVAIL.NOW I'M OUT $900.00 FOR A BLOWOUT ON A MICHELIN 4 YEAR OLD TIRE

AT HIGHWAY SPEED, DASH LIT UP WITH WARNING LIGHTS, DASH SOUNDED ALARMS, MOBILE EYE FLASHED ERR..AND DASH DISPLAY FLASHED ABS COMM ERROR! 60 SECONDS LATTER THE ENGINE STOPPED (EVERYTHING DEAD)...BUT MOTOR COACH STILL MOVING WITH NO POWER STEERING! LUCKILY I WAS ABLE TO STOP THE COACH IN A BUSY EXIT LANE. AFTER 4 HOURS (POLICE STAYED WITH US THE ENTIRE TIME)...WAS ABLE TO RESET ECM ERROR CODE AND START THE ENGINE. AFTER CONTACTING TIFFIN, THEY ADVISED TO DISCONNECT MOBILE EYE UNDER DASH. SPENT 1 HOUR UNDER DASH (WHILE IN TRAFFIC) TRYING TO FIND CONNECTION. NEVER FOUND, BELIEVE IT IS NOT UNDER DASH, BUT UP AND BEHIND A KICK PANEL? LIMPED COACH HOME...WITH THE PROBLEM RECURRING 2 ADDITIONAL TIMES. THIS A S MAJOR SAFETY PROBLEM...IMAGINE THE PANIC OF AT 70 MPH THIS PROBLEM HAPPENING...AND YOU ONLY HAVE 60 SECONDS TO FIND A SAFE PLACE TO BRING 50,000 POUNDS OF COACH TO A SAFE STOP BEFORE LOOSING ALL POWER! THIS PROBLEM HAS BEEN REPORTED MULTIPLE TIMES BY OTHERS AS RECORDED IN THE TIFFIN NETWORK FORUM. THIS SHOULD BE A TIFFIN RECALL ACTION!*DT*JB

IN NORMAL CROSS WIND CONDITIONS THE VEHICLE IS NEARLY UNCONTROLLABLE AT HIGHWAY SPEEDS. THE WIND WILL MOVE THE VEHICLE TO THE NEXT LANE WITHOUT WARNING. IT TAKES AN EXTREME AMOUNT OF STRENGTH TO CORRECT THE STEERING BACK TO THE ORIGINAL LANE. THE VEHICLE WAS MOVING ON AN INTERSTATE HIGHWAY. I CONTACTED THE MANUFACTURER AND WAS TOLD THAT THEY WERE AWARE OF THE ISSUE AND TO USE MY OWN JUDGEMENT WHEN TO STOP OPERATING THE VEHICLE DUE TO WIND.